Dodger Thoughts

Jon Weisman's outlet for dealing psychologically with the Los Angeles Dodgers, baseball and life

All you need to know about the value of hazing

If you haven’t come up with a better way to achieve your goals than hazing, you are not trying hard enough. Period.


The evolving mindset of the Dodgers


Happy Thursday chat thread


  1. WBBsAs

    I’m not sure what this is about. In fact, I have no idea whatsoever what it’s about.

  2. WinnipegDave

    Similarly, it could be said that if you end up tasering your wife in a bet – well, it’s just an all-round bad idea.

  3. btimmer

    So the Dolphins players are now going back to supporting Incognito over Martin? Oh NFL, how can you keep succeeding despite being one of the most evil entities on the planet?

    • WBBsAs

      Despicable, but also one of the most boring.

      • Jason Ungar

        I so agree. It’s so boring. I can’t watch. I try from time to time but after 5 min no way. I used to all the time. The other thing is it is not a sport i’d ever allow my kid to play, so watching it seems wrong.

        • WBBsAs

          Anecdotally speaking, I had a high-school friend who suffered a hard hit, went to the hospital for a concussion, and was never quite the same. The guy who hit him, to his credit, came to the hospital and apologized, but he was never quite the same. I could interest myself in football when I knew someone who was playing, and I haven’t been to or watched a game since my first year of college. Football is also often a scam, as witness the reconstruction of Berkeley’s Memorial Stadium atop one of the country’s most active earthquake faults, just for a handful of dates every year, even as the rest of the university starves for lack of funds.

    • Bumsrap

      Hopefully support does not lead to enabling and instead leads to treatment.

  4. Casey Barker

    I remember when Barrett Robbins left the Raiders. His teammates had some nasty things to say about him. I didn’t blame them. That’s what this story appeared to be for me.

    • btimmer

      Robbins had a diagnosed mental illness. It was in remission, but popped up again during the stress of Super Bowl Week.

      • Bumsrap

        How is a diagnosed mental illness different from an un-diagnosed mental illness? The former might result in treatment, empathy, and understanding while the latter is merely not tolerated?

  5. JonnyTAFKAJ


    Has there ever been any ‘hazing’ here on DT?


    • foul tip

      Obviously I’m not Jon. But he has had to boot a few idiots, very reluctantly.

      But more for reasons of general obnoxiousness, general bad behavior, general stupidity, and general inability to follow DT guidelines. (None that I know of were for general soreness.)

      The only haze was the one that existed between their ears.

      Going by the level of a lot of comments at, many of the booted may have come from there.

      Recalling the old song “I Lost on Jeopardy,” maybe Jon could offer t-shirts inscribed “I Got the Boot @ Dodger Thoughts” with a cartoon drawing of a boot being applied to a rear.

      Probably be a hot item and sell at least a dozen–at the bargain price of $1.298.

      • jim hitchcock

        The Hendrix doc on American Masters this week was really great.

  6. 41

    Martin was hazed for the same reason certain kids are targeted: in a small way he is different, which makes him like all of us. No way the Dodgers would tolerate this.

  7. Bumsrap

    Seattle needs a CF and may be in the Ellsbury hunt. They also have their #3 prospect Peterson coming up in 2016 at 3B and Stefen Romero ready in 2014 at 3B, 2B, or RF meaning Seager may be available in a trade. A Seager for Ethier plus cash trade might be a possibility.

  8. thescrounger

    The Reds apparently have made catcher Ryan Branigan available in trade. Considering the Dodgers’ really awful catching status throughout their system, they ought to be all over him. He’d be a much better backup or co-catcher with Ellis than Fedex is, and Fedex could be an honest replacement in Albuquerque.

    • WBBsAs

      Presumably you mean Ryan Hanigan. I fail to see how a 32-year-old career backup is a better choice than a 26-year-old who still has some upside, even if he’s not exactly Piazza or even Scioscia.

      • btimmer

        What about Laura Branigan?

        • WBBsAs

          I had to Google her, and I’m still not sure who she was. Given that she’s dead, though, I expect she has little upside.

  9. WBBsAs

    José Offerman is missing:

  10. dalegribel

    MLB Trade Rumors with a couple of sentences stating Ethier and/or Kemp could be moved this winter. First, I don’t see Kemp going anywhere. Second, an outfield of Crawford, Puig, and Pederson doesn’t seem all that formidable.

    • WBBsAs

      Ethier seems most easily replaceable and, with his relatively modest contract, the most moveable (though Dodgers would still have to eat some money). Kemp has too great an upside to move, in my opinion.

      • Bumsrap

        Ethier had a good second half before his last injury. Crawford showed he is still a very good player if he can stay healthy. If both have a good April and or May, both will get more in a trade than they will now and the Dodgers will get a longer look at Pederson and Puig and Kemp if they wait until then to make a trade.

        The Dodgers need to add an infielder to play whatever position Ramirez, Guerrero, and Gonzales don’t play if they wait until June to move one of their outfielders.

    • Bumsrap

      A Pederson, Kemp, and Puig outfield could be fun to watch should Kemp’s foot heal. Pederson voted most exciting and Puig exciting starting when he is driving to the ballpark.

  11. JonnyTAFKAJ

    On a Sunday evening….
    Ken Rosenthal says the Dodgers may be interested in dealing Kemp. Also, that Puig may be available.
    Finally, he says that the Dodgers are interested in trading for Tulo…. Just google “dodgers rumors” and the Sporting News article will come up first.
    My questions are …
    1. Is it possible that any GM looking to ‘put something out there’ might call Rosenthal? and, thus… he’s just manipulated as a ‘mouthpiece?’ ….
    2. Would you trade Puig or Kemp for Tulo?

    • John_from_Aus

      2. No way

    • berkowit28

      Unfortunately (or not), commentators like Rosenthal aren’t ever held to account or ingterviewed by anyone but their own network’s on-screen lackeys. Come the start of next season, no one will remind him of this prognostication and ask him “Where do you come up with this BS?”

      He just has space to fill, he’s as bored and anxious as we all are waiting for something to happen, and has to come up with something. That is what he came up with. Just forget about it.

    • dalegribel

      Rumors or unsubstantiated rumors? I would love to see the Dodgers get Tulo, but stepping back, any team would love to have him, it doesn’t mean that they can make it happen. I would not trade Kemp or Puig for Tulo, but I can see Ethier and/or Crawford and prospects, but Colorado isn’t going to trade him within the division.

  12. JonnyTAFKAJ

    One more thing….. Since it’s off season baseball… and, the NFL is upon us….
    One of the things this league boasts with the salary cap is ‘parity’. Thus, anybody can win it in any given year…. or so they tout.
    According to the stats, is there actually more parity league-wide?
    – Are there fewer teams with horrendous records than there were pre-salary cap?
    (I ask this because there are some pretty putrid teams)
    – Is the variation in the actual number of ‘different’ playoff teams / Super Bowl champions the same as it was pre-salary cap?

    Just asking.
    As, I’m not a whiz at getting all the ‘vital statistics’ for questions such as these like some of you guys on this blog are. :-)

  13. LittleBlueBicycle

    News out of nowhere: Braves leaving Turner Field and moving to Atlanta’s equivalent of Orange County:

  14. Bumsrap

    If the Dodgers were to trade Kemp or Puig, would Manny Machado be an acceptable part of the trade?

    • Bob_Hendley

      This is your favorite time of year, no? Machado is viewed as the second coming of Brooks Robinson/Cal Riken in Baltimore, and they are looking for pitching and would want a top flight infielder in return as well to replace Machado. I don’t see a match.

      • Bumsrap

        I enjoy kicking the tires in the off season.

        The Orioles will move Machado to short in 2015 when Hardy leaves so it would have to be the second coming of Ripkin and not Robinson.

        So, Puig is not enough? Have to throw in Lee? Might the Orioles flip Puig for Stanton and then Stanton for Sherzer?

        • Bob_Hendley

          That would be essentially Machado for Sherzer and Lee, so don’t think the O’s are up for that. They might just go FA as regards pitchers and hope that one of their yougins’ develops. Hard to imagine Puig going anywhere, Kemp wouldn’t get much value right now with that contract and coming off surgery. Ethier might be the one to move if any from the Dodgers.

          • Bumsrap

            I am guessing most people here would not trade Puig straight up for Machado which would contradict somewhat that the Orioles would not make that trade.

      • Bumsrap

        Now to kick the back tires–I would trade Gonzales for Tulowitzki and move Ramirez to first base. Yes there could be other players that would need to be involved.

        3B Machado
        CF Pederson
        1B Ramirez
        RF Kemp
        SS Tulowitzki
        LF Crawford/Ethier
        2B Guerrero
        C Ellis

    • dalegribel

      I doubt Machado will be dealt until he shows he is completely healed, if in fact he is ever dealt.

  15. Bumsrap

    While I am still playing around with fantasy, I would trade Puig for Fernandez and if Miami still wants more they can have Lee.

    • WBBsAs

      Straight up would be misguided, adding anything more would be simply foolish.

    • dalegribel

      How about straight up Puig for Stanton?

    • Bob_Hendley

      Not sure that you appreciate the value of Puig, now and how it projects into the future. In 100 games he managed a WAR of 5.0, which projects to 8.1 over 162 games. The NL leader in WAR had 8.4. Fernandez had a WAR of 6.3 in 28 starts. He was under innings restrictions that might have cost him 4 more starts with a projected WAR of 7.2. Fernandez had a great season and might be able to continue along that path, but one wonders if he can actually top it by all that much. Puig on the other hand has shown flashes that suggest he has a much higher ceiling than this year’s performance would indicate.

      • Bumsrap

        I appreciate that Puig could be the MVP 5 times over the next 10 years while at the same time worry that his trade value could just as well drop if his stats in his last 50 games better define his future performance than his stats for his first 50 games.

        • Bob_Hendley

          Like what stats? I think you mean the last 25 games, as in August he had a OPS of .920. Perhaps the stat you appreciate is the .214 BA that he put up in September. Fine, but do your realize that this was based upon a babip of .214, and that because of his ability to get on base and hit with power he still managed an OPS+ of 108. What these stats, the one that you alluded to, suggest is that that Puig at his most dismal and unluckiest is still better than the average batter.

          • Bumsrap

            I would not say he could be the mvp in 5 of next 10 years if I didn’t think Puig was great. I would prefer to trade Puig for Fernandez than trade the farm for Price. I wouldn’t cherry pick Puig’s worst month to justify but would point out that his last 50 games were not as good as his first 50 games.

          • Bob_Hendley

            Granted. But you do realize that Puig had an OPS+ of 140 over his last two months (roughly 50 games), which would have been in the top ten of the NL for the year? Dim sum nice cherries.

          • WBBsAs

            Puig is also a very young player with an enormous upside. Fluctuations such as he experienced are not unusual even for veteran players.

  16. foul tip

    OK, for your Hot Stove League perusal…Cliff Corcoran thinks Donnie should be NL Manager of Year.

    For handling injuries and everything else thrown at him this year. But says Hurdle will win.

    Says DM’s in-game strategy “wasn’t always ideal.” So noted.

  17. foul tip

    While roaming the ranch, Jay Jaffe on possible Price landing spots.

  18. NoahUCLA

    Wallach is the new bench coach and Bundy is in at 3B. Interesting. So, not much change. I don’t know much about Bundy, but having a fluent spanish speaker on the coaching staff can’t be a bad idea. Also, the Dodgers are looking at a lifetime contract for Kershaw. 15 years. I wonder if they are really paying for 15 years, or are simply trying to make sure that when they pay him over 300 million for ten years, they don’t then have to come back and worry about paying him again or that they will have to pay him to avoid ending his career somewhere else (which is a lot of what the Yankees have been dealing with with Jeter). 15 years seems just plain insane for a pitcher, but if it really is just a lifetime contract to make sure he stays a Dodger for his whole career, however long that is, I understand. What is the longest contract handed out for a player, especially a pitcher?

    • package206

      I don’t know how much money Kershaw will command but right now I would settle for a signed contract. Kershaw seems like he has some reservations about resigning. Just a feeling but it seems like he should have already been signed. He wants everyone sworn to secretacy and wants a very low profile. Maybe that’s his MO buts something does not seem right. I hope I am completely wrong.

    • WBBsAs

      I would say Manny Mota qualifies as a fluent Spanish speaker.

    • RBI

      Where do you see an offer of a 15 year contract?

      • NoahUCLA

        A second Cy Young Award will only bolster Kershaw’s leverage at the negotiating table when talks for a contract extension resume. He’s already reportedly rejected a $300 million deal that would amount to a lifetime contract, but would also commit him to the organization for 15 years or longer.

  19. NoahUCLA

    Interesting change in tone for Mattingly:
    In an interview with MLB Network during the special, Mattingly indicated that long-term contract talks between he and the Dodgers have continued this offseason, but added, “there is no real hurry or rush.”

    “I love where I’m at,” said Mattingly, whose option for the 2014 season vested when the Dodgers advanced to the NLCS. “I’m proud to be representing the Dodgers and managing their club. We’re in talks right now. Things are going good. No real hurry or rush for me at this point — I don’t think for the Dodgers either. So things are good, just working, moving forward, hoping to put something together more for the long term.”

  20. thescrounger

    Nick Punto signed with Oakland, . I wonder if the Dodgers made an offer….

    • NoahUCLA

      He’s geting twise as much as he got last year, 3 million guaranteed. Don’t know that he’s worth that for simply a bench player who can’t hit for power.

    • WBBsAs

      I found Punt’s versatility valuable, but I’m a bit bewildered that the budget-conscious A’s would pay that kind of money for him.

  21. Bob_in_Vegas

    The Kid won his 2nd CYA, according to MLB.COM!

  22. NoahUCLA

    Well deserved award Kershaw!!

  23. foul tip

    How is Guerrero doing in the Dominican?

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