Hanley Ramirez trade shakes baseball world

The earthquake before an earthquake — the Dodgers’ acquisition of Hanley Ramirez and Randy Choate from Miami — is official. Here’s some of what’s been posted in the 10 hours since the news broke.

  • Overall, the main concern regarding the decline in Ramirez’s performance in the past two years is that he might never be what he was thanks to a 2010 shoulder injury. It sure would be great to get Stan Conte’s take on him.
  • It’s been a weird year for Ramirez, who has a .336 batting average on balls in play at home, .198 on the road. His batting average reflects the difference, even though his power production is almost even home and away.
  • The Dodgers were able to nab Ramirez, according to Danny Knobler of CBSSports.com (via Hardball Talk), mainly because they were willing to take on his full contract, while Oakland was not.
  • Chad Moriyama is apprehensive about the trade but sees the upside as a worthwhile gamble.
  • Cliff Corcoran of SI.com is a bit grimmer, noting that the only saving grace of the deal for the Dodgers is that it improves an area of the team from terrible to less terrible.
  • While the Dodgers were trading for Ramirez, the Yankees were losing Alex Rodriguez for a few weeks to a fractured hand. That puts New York in the infielder market, as Jay Jaffe of SI.com discusses.
  • Cole Hamels will not be putting on a Dodger uniform. Philadelphia signed him to a six-year contract extension worth $144 million, the second-biggest deal for a pitcher ever.
  • After seeming on the verge of acquiring Ryan Dempster from the Cubs, Atlanta has backed off, reports ESPNChicago.com. That leaves the Dodgers as the apparent leading suitor — thanks, apparently, to the friendship between Dempster and Ted Lilly.  But this saga has had too many turns to make confident predictions about.
  • Dodger prospect Tae Hyeok-Nam of Ogden hit for the cycle Tuesday. Robert Emrich has details for MLB.com. The last Ogden player to do so was former Dodger and current Ogden hitting coach Doug Mientkiewicz.
  • Anonymous

    I’m surprised no one is at least noticing that he’s got the same last name as another guy in a big Dodger trade a few years ago.

    • http://www.dodgerthoughts.com/ Jon Weisman

       People have made that comment on Twitter. 

      • Adam Luther

        Hanleywood.

      • http://farinella.com/ David Farinella

        ad nauseum.

    • Anonymous

      lots of comments about getting all those #99 shirts out of storage if he will only take that number; you have to go to the sillier blogs

  • http://underdog.typepad.com/ underdog

    It sure shook me when I woke up at 6am.  Very excited. I like Eovaldi so much and feel bad to part ways for him but it’s still a more than fair price to pay, even if it’s taking a chance on a guy a bit.  None of this would have happened if we were still in old ownership, too.  It’s so cool. Hope to see him in SF this weekend.

    Sounds like Dempster may not happen at all at this point — latest is Cubs may just hold on to him. My guess is (my hope is) Dodgers didn’t want to part with A Webster either, which is fine by me.Would’ve been nice to have Dempster this weekend vs. SF though.

  • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

    Cole isn’t going anywhere

  • Adam Luther

    I’ve been searching for what type of injury he had in 2010.  Shoulder.  Hmmm..
    Ramirez historically, has hit well in Dodger Stadium, and at the other WDiv. ball parks sans SF (who does hit well there?).

  • Anonymous

    If A-Rod had broken his hand Sunday instead of yesterday, the price for Hanley might have gone up.  I’ll consider the Dodgers lucky to get him for the price they paid. 

    Playing Hanley at 3B allows Cruz to continue his hot streak at short, moves Uribe to late-inning defensive replacement, and creates a nice LF platoon of Hairston/Abreu.  Best of all, it moves Adam Kennedy to a different zip code.  

    My preferred lineup:

    Hairbreu
    Ellis
    Kemp
    Ethier
    Hanley
    Ellis
    Lonevera
    Cruz
    P

    • Adam Luther

      What do Cruz and Ramirez have in common?

      • Anonymous

        They’re both better than Dee Gordon. 

        • Adam Luther

          Cruz and Ramirez were both signed as free agents by Boston in 2000, now both age 28.

          • Anonymous

            Now THAT is a fun fact.

  • Anonymous

     
    Would rather have had a decent guy at the other corner and Fields getting a call.

    Oh well.  Is he really 28? 

    Pretty clear peak a few years ago.

    http://www.baseball-reference.com/players/r/ramirha01.shtml

    • http://www.dodgerthoughts.com/ Jon Weisman

       It’s not like Fields couldn’t play first base if the Dodgers were so motivated.

  • Anonymous

    The Cards have activated Brian Fuentes. The Dodgers can only hope he gets into the next two games.

  • Anonymous

    The impression I get is that Hanley is not a very good player right now and we are hoping he can return to the player he once was. But if he is still an improvement then what we had to start the season was horrible. OK I’m fine with the belief that we improved the team even though it cost us an arm. Who is next?

    • Anonymous

      “we improved the team even though it cost us an arm. ”
      But not an arm and a leg, unless the fleet Gordon is packaged in the Dumpster deal. 

  • Anonymous

    Dumpster threw 21 pitches in the first inning v. the Corsarios.

  • http://twitter.com/Derek_TC Derek TC

    I am really hoping Hanley wears 99 because I have an awesome blue Jersey i want to wear again lol.

  • Anonymous

    A healthy Hanley could pay off big, so it’s an exciting trade but why did he upset the easy going Ozzie so much? Was it just his slump?

    • Anonymous

       I wouldn’t call Ozzie easy-going. He’s pretty intense.

      • Anonymous

        I assumed the “easy going” was an extreme form of sarcasm.

        • Anonymous

          I should have used fun and likeable ;)

    • Anonymous

      If I had to guess, it all stems from the Marlins signing Reyes and announcing Ramirez would move to third without having a prior discussion with him regarding the position switch.

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        if that’s all it takes to cause him to go from All-Star stats to where he’s at now then that’s another problem. injuries certainly play. the big question is is the injury permanently making him a lesser player.

        • Anonymous

          Both are really an issue.  The injury being more obvious, but can a player with an ego so large he wants the betterment of the team discussed with him prior, ever be in a strong enough mental frame to excel when times get tough.

          • Anonymous

            Dale, Do you think the Dodgers would move Kemp out of CF without discussing it with him? Hanley had played in 3 minor league games at 3rd all in 2005 or earlier when the Marlins traded for Reyes. The team is the one to be criticized.

          • Anonymous

            Mike, I agree, a quality organization certainly would.  My concern is Hanley’s perceived inablity to get past that.  The closest recent Dodger scenario I can think of is Colletti calling out Kemp a couple years ago.  Yes, it affected his play at the time, then he turned his game around.  I 100% hope Ramirez does the same, but fans have reason to be concerned that he may not.

  • Anonymous

    Dempster is pitching right now so it doesn’t look like anything is imminent.

  • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

    wow when the Dodgers overpay a million or so people jump on Ned like it’s the worst thing ever. when the dodgers overpay 40 million everyone is happy. who knew?

    • Anonymous

      Yep, kinda strange. 

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        yup just plain rediculous

    • Anonymous

      It’s probably because at the time Ned was overpaying by “a million or so” the Dodgers didn’t have any money to spare.

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        uh, OK

        • http://twitter.com/Derek_TC Derek TC

          And at the time they were overpaying on guys like Uribe/Miles/Carroll/Kennedy and letting guys like Kuroda walk away.

          • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

            Carroll was a great deal. kennedy overpaid at $800 K?. M Ellis, Hairston, C cap overpaid?

          • http://twitter.com/Derek_TC Derek TC

            Collectively, Ned paid about 15 million to guys who were historically not very good and let Kuroda go. Collectively those guys have been playing pretty well but who is calling them overpaid now? Your argument is ridiculous. You will notice I said “at the time”. Also, any amount of money given to Kennedy to play baseball is an overpayment, so yes, 800k is overpayment.

        • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_53Y6B3KAAVOECSA5E666M4CVLE MRF

          LADodgersFan88 is exactly right.  People were complaining because Frank kept the budget really small and Ned was using it on Uribe and Harang while letting Kuroda go.  With the new ownership willing to spend money, people are not as concerned about this move limiting the Dodgers in the future.

          • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

            yeah that must be it. NOT

          • http://pulse.yahoo.com/_53Y6B3KAAVOECSA5E666M4CVLE MRF

            Impressive comeback.

          • http://twitter.com/Derek_TC Derek TC

            Trollolololol. 

          • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

            well i can’t give my full explanation in detail without breaking several rules and thus having to ban myself. so whatever you say is good with me. carry on.

          • T.M. Brown

            When did we get a troll on the DT chat? 

    • Vail Beach

      It’s like Stalin’s philosophy of murder.  One is a tragedy.  A million are a statistic.  

      But I like this deal, so … 

    • Anonymous

      It’s only over paying if he doesn’t get back near his previous performance levels.  Money allows teams to take risks and this is definitely a big risk.

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        i would agree on your IF. however risk management takes it one step further and asks how likely is it that hanley will return to all-star form. offensively that is. i think everyone would agree he can’t play defense well. how many star players after two bad years come back and recapture  their former stats. it certainly does happen. but i wonder what the stats are on that. again i think they had to do it because of market conditions. even if he makes it half way back that would make it good enough regarding this transaction.

        • Anonymous

          Agreed.  Which leads me to believe they feel (hope?) that the majority of his current struggles are mental.  Fresh start will help this for a while, but long term is a crap shoot.  It worked with Manny for 1/2 a season, but then the off season contract issue factored in and then of course, needles.

  • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

    If I was the Cubs I’d happily tell both the Dodgers and Dempster to shove it. beat the braves deal or take a hike. mr dempster i hope you have a wonderful summer in chicago playing for our horrible team on your 36th birthday. we’re calling your bluff dude.

    • Anonymous

      And in doing so lose any slim chance they had in re-signing him this winter. Dude has been a Cubbie for 11 years, he knows what being on a lousy team is all about.

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        no way he’s signing with the cubs. i think you can pretty much bank on that.

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        theo isn’t interested in 36 year old pitchers at this point

        • Anonymous

          How old was Wakefield the last time Theo signed him to a contract? From what I have read both sides were at least somewhat agreeable to him coming back. Who knows truth from rumor?

          • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

            uh the red sox were contenders the cubs not so much

    • Anonymous

      If you were the Cubs we wouldn’t be subjected to so much nonsense here.

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        thanks Tink. didn’t know you cared.

  • Anonymous

    A left side of Hanley and Cruz “sounds” much better than Uribe and Gordon, IMO.

  • Christopher Staaf

    I am pretty excited about Hanley Ramirez coming to LA. He definitely needs a change of scenery from Florida, plus he just wasn’t the same playing 3B after the Reyes signing. I know the Dodgers are picking up the money on him but I am glad it only really just cost Nathan Eovaldi (best wishes to him) and a minor leaguer to get the 3 time All Star who’s still only 28. 

  • http://profile.yahoo.com/MW2R2Q72LP22HKPEXB2ZZPHSZM dud dew

    In Hanley’s impressive stat years, he was a galling player, a perfect fit for bad Marlin baseball years.
    This is no coup….He’s a primary reason I don’t consider watching the Marlins watching MLB, and rarely do it anymore (although I gotta admit all of MLB is playing more Little League this year than ever:-).  Watched the Yanks of late???

    I think the Phils will regret that contract… Think the Ds mighta been lucky Ruben is feeling much local pressure.

    This move continues and increases my skepticism about the “new” front office.

    While he was still leading 2-0 last night, with Smoltz singin’ his praises, and apparently in a nice rhythm, I said to a buddy, observing little things, it’s gonna be a while, if ever, that Clayton
    challenges Sandy’s Five Years of Wonder….

    • Anonymous

       Just think of it as over 100 ops better than the guy at the other corner, with 7x the HRs.

    • http://www.dodgerthoughts.com/ Jon Weisman

       Maybe so, but Koufax didn’t have his first strong above-average season until he was 25. Kershaw is still only 24, and his first above-average season came at 21.

      That doesn’t take innings and pitch counts into account, though.

      • Anonymous

         My favorite part of his legend is just that – he was genuinely mediocre until his hundredth or so start.

  • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

    Just Wondering. What’s the chances Hanley is not really 28?

    • http://www.dodgerthoughts.com/ Jon Weisman

       There is something weird about his early peak, although the injuries would help explain it.  Meanwhile, this far into his career, wouldn’t it have come out if he were faking?

      • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

        yes i think so. the last two years would make more sense if he was now 30 but i was just wondering. it was a trade the dodgers had to make because of market conditions. but it is truly a high-wire gamble. i like that they weren’t afraid to do it. but there are a number of things going against it working out well for all concerned.

      • Rock Well

        Could it be that last year’s injury and subsequent off-season surgery hasn’t quite healed?  Most TJ procedures take almost 2 full years for a player to be 100%.  I think his value to the team will be seen next year with a full season removed from the injury.  He can still be a .375+ OPB, 15+ HR’s and 20-30 steals type guy.

        I like that the dodgers are taking a chance on him and I think Mattingly and the coaching staff are really going to help him get his career turned around.

        cr

    • Anonymous

      Compare Hanley’s performance by age with Nomar’s.  Eerily similar WAR numbers, and Nomar’s also dropped off at about the same age.  With Nomar, we’re pretty sure that was due to accumulated injuries.  Same could be true for Hanley.

      • Anonymous

        Actually, some character assassins around Boston started whispering that Nomar’s dropoff was due to his PED cessation.  They waited until after he was traded to make these allegations, however.  

        • Anonymous

          As a Bostonian at the time, there was plenty of specluation about that long before the trade.  I was doing plenty of it, and I still think that was the case.  Hell, I always thought Johnny Damon was a juicer too. 

  • http://www.twitter.com/ElJefedor Jeffrey Thomas III

    I can’t wait to watch this all go down on The Franchise.

  • Anonymous

    I will miss Nathan.  However, I think this is a good trade.  Hanley could plug a hole (one of them) that we’ve been complaining about since the beginning of the season.  We’ve got the money, lets see where this takes us.

  • Anonymous

    I understand Ramirez is on the DL; anyone know when he gets off? I really don’t understand fans with grudges against players. We’ve had and have lot’s of players I didn’t personally like but if they play well for us, I give them credit. Example I really don’t like Hunter Pence (I don’t know why) but rumor has it he’s available and I’d love to see the Dodgers get him.

    • http://www.dodgerthoughts.com/ Jon Weisman

       He’s not on the DL.

  • http://underdog.typepad.com/ underdog

    Mattingly on Jim Rome right now if anyone’s interested

    • Anonymous

      Didn’t make it in time.  Anything of interest come of it?

  • Anonymous

    I too am sad to see Eovaldi go and wish him well with Miami. Also excited to have another much-needed bat in the lineup and Eovaldi was the obvious choice to use to get that bat as Dodgers have the starting pitching options to afford saying goodbye to Nathan.

    Didn’t get to see any of the game last night. Did anyone notice if it was a case of Kershaw getting away from using his offspeed stuff and relying too heavily on his fastball? I sometimes get the impression that when Kershaw gets in trouble he falls in love with his fastball, trying to overpower the hitters, instead of putting his straight change and awesome curveball to more and better use. IDK, like I said I didn’t see the game, but often when watching Kershaw I wish he would use his slower pitches more often to keep the hitters offbalance. MLB hitters love the hard stuff, doesn’t matter if it’s mid-90′s they will eventually catch up to it – with Kershaw’s beautiful overhand curve, I would love to see him use it more – or (as far as last night goes) am I offbase here?

    • http://veryolddodgerfan.blogspot.com/ veryolddodgerfan

      honestly i think the heat got him.

      • Anonymous

        OK thanks vodf

    • http://underdog.typepad.com/ underdog

      I don’t know how cogent my analysis will be here regarding Kershaw but it basically seemed like he was rolling along well and then sometime in the 5th started to run out of gas. Keep in mind he threw a lot of pitches in the game before and then it was 100 degrees and humid in St Louis. I’m sure Dodgers wanted him to go 6th but he clearly lost it. He first lost the feel for the curve around then, and that may have also been due to the heat + sweat. So he may have started relying more on the fastball around then, because of that. He left a lot more pitches up than usual, usually he mixes it up well, has stuff drop deceptively. And it was doing that for the first 4+ innings. 

      Anyway, I think it was basically being tired and overheated, lost the feel for his pitches. Nothing long term to worry about. 

      I know Dodgers’ pen is already overused this past week but I felt like they should’ve taken him out a few batters earlier. 

      • Anonymous

        Donnie B needs to stop trying to be everyone’s friend. CK isn’t anywhere near enough wins to get the Cy in any case.

        • Anonymous

          We are really lucky to have someone with inside sources to tell us what Mattingly’s faults are.

          • Anonymous

            Don’t get me wrong – we’re lucky to have the legacy of the GM, manager, and prospect roster left over from Frank’s era.  Almost as lucky as we are to have a few dozen of Frank’s friends and family still owning the parking lots.

      • Anonymous

        Thanks for the analysis underdog – appreciate it.

  • Anonymous

    2 Whiteside, 3 Belt and 6 Arias instead of the usual suspects at the bay supporting Timmy.

    I assume Nate S will come in by the 7th.

    • Anonymous

       Whiteside is a far better defensive catcher than the pseudo-All Star Gnatfans like to brag about.

  • Anonymous

    When is Hanley scheduled to be in Dodger Blue. We can use him as a pinch runner while his hand mends?

    • Anonymous

      he played the full game in Miami last night against Atlanta; went 1 for 4

      • Anonymous

         He also blew an easy DP grounder at third.

        • Anonymous

          don’t think that was due to his hand (but I didn’t see it)

          • Anonymous

             No, he just misplayed a routine grounder.

    • Anonymous

      That’s a good question and raises another question of just how severe his hand infection injury is.

  • Anonymous

    I think it is a great deal for Hanley.  There just weren’t that many options out there, and he is a desperately needed power bat if nothing else.  I too loke EO, but we have plenty of pitching in the pipeline compared to hitting. 

  • foul tip

    “Having spoken by phone with his new player, Mattingly said Ramirez initially will take over shortstop, where Luis Cruz has filled in well during the absence of Dee Gordon.”

    http://losangeles.dodgers.mlb.com/news/article.jsp?ymd=20120725&content_id=35530624&vkey=news_la&c_id=la

    An earlier Gurnick story said SS too.  But a direct quote from Don obviously carries more weight.

    Maybe he thinks Ramirez is more comfortable at SS, and it’s best to play him there at least at first to help him turn it around and get a good start.  To me, that’s a stretch.  But why else?

    If this is so, does Cruz move to 3B?  What’s wrong with this picture?  My reception is fuzzy.

    • Anonymous

      Makes the assumption that Ramirez’s glove at SS plus Cruz’s at 3b  yeilds a better team defense than the other way around.

      • foul tip

         Ramirez is described as a defensive mediocrity at best, wherever he plays.

        Cruz at SS seems to be steady, particularly throwing, even if he doesn’t have great range.

        Why would the worse defender play short, given its defensive value, more chances and such?

        My reception is still fuzzy.  ;-])

        • Anonymous

           I’d leave Cruz at short, with Hanley at third.

      • Anonymous

        But Cruz at 3B now is quite toothless. Might as well leave Uribe there. I can’t believe I said that. Let me get some grub before I say anything else.

        • Anonymous

          It’s actually a rather sane statement.  Uribe’s defense is superior and Cruz’s bat is certainly quieting down.  For my 2 cents, I still go with Cruz, but that’s just me.

  • Anonymous

    The sounds of silence in Philly – 5-5 top of the 9th.

    This will more or less end their season if Mil wins this.

  • Anonymous

    Dodgers are talking to Phillies… Wouldn’t it be great to get either Pence or Victorino? We could even keep Loney although I’d non-tender him and offer a lot less than we’re paying him. We could sell (or try) Rivera and Abreu, Gwynn and Hairston as our extra outfielders. 

    • Anonymous

      I’d like to keep Hairston, and am happy that Donnie finally picked up on the fact that he’s a much, much better LFer than 3b.

      • Anonymous

         Hairston’s IF-OF versatility works in his favor.

      • Anonymous

        Hairston was playing 3b because no other player could provide offense; when he went to Mattingly to say he was not comfortable there Mattingly stopped playing him at 3rd until Gordon got hurt and Herrera who was playing some 3rd went to AAA in favor of Cruz to play ss. Your “finally” is based on absolutely nothing.

        • Anonymous

          “Absolutely nothing” is what donnie brings to managing when it involves making his players uncomfortable.

          Last night’s game was a good example of that, as was his apparent ignorance of Hairston’s record at 3b.

          All just opinions, though.

    • Anonymous

      I would most like Rivera dealt out of that group.  Still need a 4′th outfielder like Gwynn.  Abreu has no power and is a – on defense but he’s a valuable part of that lineup with his selective approach at the plate.

    • Anonymous

      it would not be great to get either. Victorino is hitting 237 away from their bandbox stadium. Pence is not worth the money he will get through arb. or the threat of it next year. He will get Ethier type money which Ethier is not worth but Pence is not the player Ethier is. Pence is a decent player but there must be a limit on what Dodger ownership is willing to spend. Fortunately, I am confident the Phillies overvalue Victorino and I doubt the Dodgers have the players to get Pence who the Phillies do not overvalue which would be why he might be available and they don’t want to go to arb. with him I ‘m sure

  • Anonymous

    I’d say two things.  First, “overpay” is a judgment call.  So probably not a lot of people who really think this is a $40M overpayment are happy.  I’d say those are two different groups of people.

    Second, setting aside the question of “over”paying, there is a consistency to getting on Colletti for throwing multiple millions at over-the-hill-at-best-mediocrities while approving the spending of a huge wad of money on stars.  Colletti’s M.O. has been to overpay for veteran depth.  In the best case scenario, most of those millions are on the bench, because starters stay healthy.  More likely, because these guys are old and mediocre, starters and bench guys are all needed and essentially interchangeable because they all stink and they’re all injury-prone.  So in the end, it looks like he really needed all those guys, but it might have been much wiser to replace all those $9M/$12M contracts for PVL for a single giant contract for a young, healthy star, and instead fill the bench with cheap, young guys who won’t play much at all.

    The Pierre/Jones/Schmidt contracts were huge, but they were just even more expensive versions of the same sort of Colletti logic.  As far as I can tell, only the Manny Ramirez, and now Kemp and Ethier contracts fit the desciption of huge money for difference makers.  Maybe you could say the same about the first Furcal contract, although the second was more typically Colleti-ish (since Furcal was known by then to be a huge injury risk).

    So if you think that Hanley Ramirez has really lost it at 28 and will never approach his performance of a few years ago (which I agree is a big risk) then this is a terrible overpayment and a bad deal and you shouldn’t be happy.  But if you believe for some reason that the old Hanley will re-emerge, then this is a good deal.

    • Anonymous

      Oops, that was supposed to be a reply to veryolddodgerfan’s earlier comment:

      “wow when the Dodgers overpay a million or so people jump on Ned like
      it’s the worst thing ever. when the dodgers overpay 40 million everyone
      is happy. who knew?”

      • Anonymous

         If I had to pay Hanley’s daily salary, it would be overpaying. For the Guggenheimers, it’s an incidental expense.

        • Anonymous

          I don’t think there’s any question that if the Hanley Ramirez of the last 2 years is the real Hanley Ramirez – if that’s the performance we can expect for the duration of this contract, then he is a shadow of his former self and this is a huge misuse of team resources (which while extensive, are not infinite).  This is a gamble on resurrection that a rich team can afford to take.  Since his peak performance was as a skinny young middle infielder, I’m inclined to think that his decline is not PED withdrawal.  But I am worried that he’ll never be 100% healthy again, a la Nomar, or more recently, Justin Morneau or Chase Utley.  For every Jamie Moyer, there’s a guy whose body  craps out early.  Greg Oden anyone?

  • Vail Beach

    I don’t necessarily agree that Hanley’s current performance equates to “over the hill” suspicions.  14 home runs so far in 2012 is good to go. 

    My question is this.  If part of Hanley’s attitude problem stems from having to move to 3B, does that mean he will only thrive as our SS?  And if so, does that mean the Dee Gordon era is over? 

    • Anonymous

      There’s one suggestion I’ve seen that says Ramirez’s long term Dodger position is 1B.  Kind of a Carlos Guillen scenario.  (Please don’t use Ernie Banks as a better example, at least not now).

    • Anonymous

      I suspect the thinking is play Hanley at SS while Dee is out, see how he fares there. Once Dee is ready to return, they will be able to make the decision if moving Ramirez to 3rd would be a good idea. A lot can happen between now and when Dee is ready to play.

      • http://web.me.com/kakitadoug/geekblog/Blog/Blog.html DougS

        Makes sense to me. Both long-term and short-term, the Dodgers have a wider and deeper hole at 3B than at SS. Unless you think Gordon is going to be a complete flop, and I think it’s still way too early to say for sure.

    • Anonymous

      I am hoping Hanley’s problem is his shoulder surgery of last Sept.

  • Anonymous

    Lincecum gets the hook down 5-1 in the fifth.

    • Anonymous

       The patient Gnat hitters have forced Jason Marquis to throw 66 pitches through five.

      • Anonymous

        You mean Jason “most wins in baseball in July” Marquis?  Or is it Jason “more wins this year than Halladay” Marquis?  That guy?

  • Anonymous

    Imagine if we could bring up Fields and try him as a 7th inning guy.

    Something like 8 cruz 9 fields 1 ramirez 2 ellis 3 kemp 4 dre. I like how that looks a lot more than Loneduribennedy.

    • Anonymous

       Normally, though, you don’t designate infielders to play certain innings.

      • Anonymous

        Sure, but we’ve been an exceptionally platoony club with all the injuries.  I’d just like to see Fields as one of those pitcher-switch platooners. 

        • Anonymous

           Opinion appears universal that Fields is a terrible defensive infielder.

      • Anonymous

        I would be happy to designate Uribe as an 8th and 9th inning infielder.  Loney too. 

        • Anonymous

          And Gwynn, right?  But how many defensive replacements can a team carry?

  • T.M. Brown

    Been waiting all day for FGs take and it didn’t disappoint:
    http://www.fangraphs.com/blogs/index.php/hanley-gives-dodgers-life-on-left-side/

    • Anonymous

      “Luckily for the Dodgers, though, anything above what Hanley has done already this season — a .329 wOBA, 104 wRC+ — is gravy. Hanley’s 4.2 wRAA so far beats Los Angeles’s third base production to date by 17 runs and beats their shortstop production by 20 runs. Juan Uribe, Dee Gordon, Justin Sellers, Adam Kennedy — Ramirez is a vast improvement over this motley crew of left-side laggards.”

      I like it too.

  • Anonymous

    Tonight’s lineup
    Abreu LF
    Ellis 2B
    Kemp CF
    Ethier RFRamirez 3B
    Loney 1B
    Cruz SS
    Ellis C
    Harang P

    • Anonymous

      Other than Ellis batting 8th instead of 6th, I get my wish.

      • Anonymous

        except your wish, if I understood your earlier post, was not merely for a starting line-up for this game. Abreu and Loney are starting because Lohse’s splits demand as may LHH as reasonable. I had the same line-up for tonight many hours before the Hanley trade but with Herrera at 3rd coming back from AAA. Before the trade we had 5 regulars, currently we have 6 and even then they will be rested for some games. Rivera and Hairston will play when RHH are desired.

        • Anonymous

          My wish assumed that Rivera and Hairston would be the RH version of Loney and Abreu, respectively.  

          Slotting Hanley in at 3B rather than SS is a none-too-subtle message to Uribe.  Even if Ramirez ends up playing SS more often.

          • Anonymous

            Message to Hanley too?

    • Anonymous

      Huh – so much for Ramirez supplanting Cruz at SS – I like this much better than Cruz @ 3rd myself, I just hope Ramirez doesn’t play too many potential DP’s into E-5′s as he did last night.

      • Anonymous

         I like it more as well.  Sub Hairston for Abreu and 8/9 of it is inoffensive.

        • foul tip

          Actually, better if it is offensive. Haven’t we had enough inoffensive/unoffensive/outright awful lineups already?    ;-])

      • Anonymous

        It’s likely that Ramirez hasn’t taken any grounders at shortstop this year in preparation for the move to third. He might not want to have switched gears that quickly.

        Or maybe Mattingly didn’t want to stick Hairston or Uribe at third. 

        For differing reasons.

        • Anonymous

          Hairston is 3 for 17 against Lohse who pitches a good deal better vs RHH; Uribe is 3 for 18 if it matters. What does matter is Mattingly has said he looks at H/P histories and his line-ups reflect that he places importance on them

        • http://web.me.com/kakitadoug/geekblog/Blog/Blog.html DougS

          “Or maybe Mattingly didn’t want to stick Hairston or Uribe at third. ”

          Either way, can we blame him?

      • Anonymous

         Yeah, he butchered an easy one last night.

  • Anonymous

    Gnats being pesky again -  6-3, two on, two out, bottom of the eighth. SD bringing in Street.

    • Anonymous

      And Huston is a one-way street. Cabrera strikes out to end the inning.

      That joke doesn’t make sense, but stuff like that got Tim McCarver a spot on the dais at Cooperstown.

      • Anonymous

         I’m amazed that a mediocrity like Street’s had such a long career.

        • Anonymous

          Street has been far from mediocre this year.

          • Anonymous

            His career, though, has been very erratic, and he’s been injury-prone. I wouldn’t want to see him in a Dodger uniform.

        • Anonymous

           Not to mention a mediocrity like McCarver. 

  • Anonymous

    Ramierez needs to be a SS.  I think the reason he has failed so miserably is because of of bringing in Reyes.  The Dodgers need to give Hanley confidence.  I don’t think he wants to play 3rd.

    • http://www.twitter.com/ElJefedor Jeffrey Thomas III

      He’s said he will play wherever they want him to, so let’s just wait and see. I think Donnie and Kemp can get him motivated.

      • Anonymous

        Although he has said he would play both positions, I feel to give him SS would have been motivation immediately, besides, SS is his natural position.

        • http://www.twitter.com/ElJefedor Jeffrey Thomas III

          We’ll see. Apparently he told Donnie he wasn’t comfortable starting at SS tonight. So maybe once he takes some ground balls there and gets comfortable again he will move back.

      • Anonymous

        That the right thing for him to say, let’s hope he believes it.  I also agree with you on DM and MK taking charge. 

  • http://www.facebook.com/people/Terry-Pruett/1707390003 Terry Pruett

    With the bad shape our farm system is in (zero every day players in the minors with star-level ability, with the possible exception of Puig), and with the free agent pickings getting slimmer by the minute, the only way for this team to improve is by taking on questionable contracts for the next 2-3 years. The Dodger payroll is artificially low right now, taking into account the teams attendance and soon-to-be-consumated TV rights deal. With all of this in mind this is exactly what we should be doing…and, we should be going after Pence as well…he as an .823 career OPS (119 OPS+) and is dead flat in the middle of his prime.

    • Anonymous

      …and he’s tall enough to play 1b!

      • Anonymous

        Garvey is listed at 5’10′. There are about 7 ML players shorter than that I guess. Pence has never played  first as a pro. Piazza couldn’t play first. Your posts are not based in reality.

        • Anonymous

           
          Posey had less than 10% of his over 300 pro games at 1B before he was moved.

          I honestly don’t know why Garvey or Piazza are relevant.

          Pence also lacks giant forearms and a mullet.

    • Anonymous

      As I said below Pence will get a big raise next season as he is arb. eligible; he is not having a season to justify such. We are as good as any team in the national league or will be soon. I see no reason to rush.
      btw, look at the Phillies and tell me how it makes sense that he is available, if he is. He is relatively young on that team. If he is available it is because there is a problem between Pence and “old friend” Charlie Manuel. Which one is nuts I do not know but I know which one Manuel thinks is.  

  • Anonymous

    Padres just beat the Giants, 6-3.

    • Anonymous

      musica en mis oidos.

  • Anonymous

    Both Ellis’s have been striking out more often than earlier. 
    Mark 18 in 154 PA before getting hurt, 11.7%
             13 in 60 since returning,  21.7%
    AJ 15.5% in 103 PA last year
         24.2% in 298 PA this year
         30.1% in 133 PA during June and July combined
    For comparison Kemp’s % in 2010 was 25.5%

  • http://www.dodgerthoughts.com/ Jon Weisman

    NPUT

  • Anonymous

    i like the move (we desperately need power) but i think time will tell how impact full the move really is, best wishes to Eovaldi.Can’t wait to see him July 31st at DS!! 

  • Anonymous

    This is a fantastic trade. I was dreading that we’d be several games out of contention by this point, but not only did the team perform on the field, we picked up with a guy who, even if his decline is permanent, would still be a huge upgrade at either 3rd or SS for the life of his contract, and a dominant lefty reliever. I don’t know where this leaves us for the offseason, but I feel much better about our chances this season with Hanley and Choate on board.

    Moreover, this trade might end up being the best thing for Eovaldi, who will now get the same opportunity to refine his repertoire in a low-stress environment just like James McDonald.